In this unit, students will read interviews with musicians in Talk That Music Talk
as a group in class or at individually at home to learn about the music community in New Orleans.
Troy “Trombone Shorty” Andrews is held up by his mother, Lois Andres, to play a plastic saxophoneas the Olympia Brass Band parades by.
The clarinet player with sunglasses on is Joseph Torregano, Trombone Shorty’s future music teacher.
Photograph by Michael P. Smith, courtesy of The Historic New Orleans Collection.
LESSON PLAN
•To be able to critically engage an interview to under-stand point-of-view and how to assess what is important to the narrator.
•To develop a deeper understanding of how practicing music, playing with others, and participating in com-munity-based events create a framework for immersing oneself in a “New Orleans sound.”
•To understand how one’s own musical practices are connected to the larger bodies of music, and to expand one’s horizons based on studying different styles that have developed in jazz, gospel, and R&B.
This lesson could be structured over a few days, or on-and-off throughout the semester.
• Copies of Talk That Music Talk.
• Handouts of Discussion Guides for each interview
• Handout of Kirk’s Listening Journey
• Handout of Mapping Listening Journeys
• Handout of Video Response
• Audio-visual equipment for listening to the songs/watching videos of the performances.
STEP 1: Organize the students into their sections in the band (by instrument). If you are teaching a Language Arts class, create your own groups. Each group will read an interview from Talk That Music Talk. Students can read it as homework, or they can break into small groups and read the chapter together. If there is limited time, each person in the groups can read a separate chapter, and come to-gether to discuss.
STEP 2: In small groups, or as an entire class, have stu-dents read Kirk Joseph’s interview with Anthony Bennett. Once students have read the chapter, have them fill out the reading guide on their own, and then come together as a group to share their answers. Students should discuss each of their answers to the guide, and share there “takeways” with each other. If time permits, students can present their findings as a group to the class.
STEP 3: Pass out the handouts, “Kirk’s Listening Jour-ney” and “Video Response” If time permits, students can listen to the different videos in class to hear the different styles of music Kirk has been influenced by and how with Kirk’s own style of playing the sousaphon has developed. Students can fill out the Video Response handouts as they listen, and share with the class how it may be similar or different to the way they play
STEP 4: Once they have completed Kirk’s example, they can work in sections (depending on the size of the class, a few groups may be needed in each section) on a chap-ter of their own. Once they have completed the discus-sion guide, have them prepare a presentation for the class. What are the “takeaways” from learning so much about individual instruments, and how do they interact as a jazz band?
STEP 5: Students can now investigate the musical trajec-tories of the people in their chapter. In groups, or at home, they will research songs that the musicians mentioned in their chapters to create “listening journeys” similar to the one they heard for Kirk Joseph.
STEP 6: If time permits, each group can make a presen-tation to the class about what they learned. How has this investigation had an impact on their own playing? How does it make them think about playing as acollective?
HANDOUT
Directions: Read the conversation between Kirk Joseph and Anthony Bennett.
Below is a guide to help you read through the interview and prepare to present the chapter to your classmates.
Include your own notes and reflections as well! (An important skill in ethnography.)
• What is Kirk’s family background in music and how is it related to the development of the Dirty Dozen Brass Band?
• Who were Kirk’s musical influences?
• How does a musician handle the emotion involved in a jazz funeral? How does Kirk react to the events?
• How did Kirk teach Anthony about the rhythms in a brass band?
• How did Kirk learn to improvise and how did listening to other musicians impact his own style of playing?
• What did you learn about the sousaphone from reading the interview? What is the sousaphone’s role in a band and how does the rhythm section interact with the other instruments?
• Other important parts of the interview to highlight include:
The Takeaway: What is the main “takeaway” from Kirk’s talk with Anthony? What is the most important insight to you, and how does it relate to your own experiences with music?
HANDOUT
Directions: Throughout Kirk’s interview, he describes his journey into music.
In your section, follow the links listed below to listen to some of his early development.
Listen to the differences in bass patterns: New Orleans traditional jazz, R&B, and modern brass band rhythms.
How has the sound of the bass and sousa-phone changed over time?
How have jazz funerals changed?
Waldren “Frog” Joseph’s Band’s Old New Orleans Dixieland (Full album)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mIW9rPQ3UM
Paul Barbarin’s jazz funeral in 1969
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05WCrH-kCg
A Waldren “Frog” Joseph playing trombone on “Dickerson Strut” with Placide Adams in Louis Cottrell’s Band
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FT2EITQPtjw
Frank Fields playing bass on Elmore James’ “Good Bye Baby”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZry4TfXBGw
Walter Payton playing upright bass on “Tailgate Ramble” o with the Preservation Hall Band
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7M8ZkQma3I
Kirk Joseph playing sousaphone on the Dirty Dozen’s “Blackbird Special “(Live)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7qA32D308k
Anthony “Tuba Fats” Lacen’ playing sousaphone on “Over in Glory Land”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-POWEjL940
Kerwin James playing sousaphone on the New Birth Brass Band’s “Here We Go.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vnCDGuLtbM
Kerwin James’ jazz funeral in October 6, 2007
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rg1xRPV_nlU
Kirk Joseph’s Backyard Groove
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iF9X2muNyN0
Kirk Joseph’s Tuba Tuba (A band of tubas)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ypzM9vFT2Y
Next Steps: Research and present two other artists that play sousaphone and give three examples of how their music fits into the history of bass patterns in New Orleans, what they are doing that’s new.
As a group, share your research with the whole class, and discuss how the bass and snare drums interact with the sousa-phone in a New Orleans jazz band.
HANDOUT
Overview: As you listen to the music, fill out the response sheet to be able to keep track of your reactions to the music and be able to discuss the songs in-depth with your classmates.
ARTISTS:
SONGS: GENRES:
YOUR REACTIONS:
HOW ARE THEY DIFFERENT OR SIMILAR TO OTHER SONGS YOU HAVE HEARD OR PLAYED?
HANDOUT
Directions: Throughout the interviews in Talk That Music Talk, we learn how different people and styles of music were influential in musicians’ development.
Map out the musical journey you learned about in the chapter you just read by researching songs and videos.
Keep a log of your favorite videos as a reference to share with your classmates.
Early Influences
Current influences
Videos or songs played by the interviewee
Videos of cultural events metioned in the interview
Next Steps: Research and present two other artists that play the same instrument and give three examples of how their music fits into this instrument in New Orlean.
What they are doing that’s new. As a group, share your research with the whole class.
HANDOUT
Directions: Read John Michael Bradford’s interview with Woody Penouilh.
Below is a guide to help you read through with the interview and prepare to present the chapter to your classmates.
Include your own notes and reflections as well! (An important skill in ethnography.)
• What childhood experiences opened John Michael up to music?
• What did John Michael learn from playing at Jackson Square?
• How did Kenny teach John Michael to play by ear?
• What are the differences in how a traditional and modern jazz band interact with an audience?
• What did you learn about the trumpet from reading the interview? What does “singing through the trum-pet” mean?
• Other important parts of the interview to highlight include:
The Takeaway: What is the main “takeaway” from John Michael’s talk with Kenny?
What is the most im-portant insight to you, and how does it relate to your own experiences with music?
HANDOUT
Directions: Read Doyle Cooper’s interview with Woody Penouilh.
Below is a guide to help you read through with the interview and prepare to present the chapter to your classmates.
Include your own notes and reflections as well! (An important skill in ethnography.)
• What childhood experiences opened Doyle up to a wide musical universe?
• According to Doyle, what is the advantage of learning by ear?
• How has music allowed Doyle to experience things that otherwise he could not experience?
• How has music allowed him to cross racial boundaries?
• What did you learn about the trumpet from reading the interview? What similarities does Doyle see be-tween the sousaphone and the trumpet?
• Other important parts of the interview to highlight include:
The Takeaway: What is the main “takeaway” from Doyle’s talk with Woody?
What is the most important insight to you, and how does it relate to your own experiences with music?
HANDOUT
Directions: Read the conversation between Jeremy Jeanjacques and Joseph Torregano.
Below is a guide to help you read through with the interview and prepare to present the chapter to your classmates.
Include your own notes and reflections as well! (An important skill in ethnography.)
• What do Jeremy and Joe say about the importance of marching bands in New Orleans schools?
• How did Jeremy’s neighborhood open him up to a musical universe outside of school?
• What did Jeremy learn by playing traditional jazz as well as marching band music?
• What did Jeremy do in his section after he worked with professional jazz musicians?
• What did you learn about the trombone from reading the chapter?
• What is the bass drum’s role in a brass band and how does it interact with the other instruments?
• Other important parts of the interview to highlight include:
The Takeaway: What is the main “takeaway” from Jeremy’s conversation with Joe?
What is their most im-portant insight to you, and how does it relate to your own experiences with music?
HANDOUT
HANDOUT
Directions: Read the conversation between Thaddeus Ramsey and Julius Lewis.
Below is a guide to help you read through the interview and prepare to present the chapter to your classmates.
Include your own notes and reflections as well! (An important skill in ethnography.)
• What childhood experiences opened Thaddeus up to a wide musical universe?
• What instruments did he play, and where did he learn them?
• What did Thaddeus learn about New Orleans music when he lived in Texas after Hurricane Katrina?
• Who encouraged Thaddeus to have a deeper appreciation of different kinds of music?
• What did you learn about the bass drum while reading the chapter.
•What is the bass drum’s role in a brass band and how does it interact with the other instruments?
• Other important parts of the interview to highlight include:
The Takeaway: What is the main “takeaway” from Thaddeus’s conversation with Julius?
What is their most important insight to you, and how does it relate to your own experiences with music?
Directions: Read the conversation between Jeremy Jeanjacques and Joseph Torregano.
Below is a guide to help you read through with the interview and prepare to present the chapter to your classmates.
Include your own notes and reflections as well! (An important skill in ethnography.)
• Joe says that becoming a teacher is like, “becoming a priest.” What does he mean by that and how did he and didn’t he fit the role?
• Who were some important mentors for in Joe’s life as a professional musician and as a teacher?
• Why were they important to him?
• Why are high school bands an important part of music education in New Orleans?
• What challenges are faced by band and music directors in New Orleans since Hurricane Katrina?
• How many times would Joe listen to a song he was trying to learn?
• What did you learn about the clarinet from reading the chapter?
•What is the bass drum’s role in a brass band and how does it interact with the other instruments?
• Other important parts of the interview to highlight include:
The Takeaway: What is the main “takeaway” from Jeremy’s conversation with Joe?
What is their most important insight to you, and how does it relate to your own experiences with music?
